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Deva Blackfire
Priory Of The Lemon
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.02 13:29:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 02/02/2010 13:35:47
1st: what do you want to do? PvE? PvP?
For PvE legions are decent (no ammo use for WH space etc). For missions stick to battleships.
For PvP - just go proteus. Long scrambler, same tank as legion, same/better damage in all ranges (fit dependant). And actually it is possible to break 600dps on gank fits if you want it, where legion is just stuck there.
So 1st tell what do you want to use it for and then i guess i can get you some setups/guidelines.
Also in before butthurt idiot trying to prove me wrong and failing again.
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Deva Blackfire
Priory Of The Lemon
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.02 14:36:00 -
[2]
Yes you can. And in this case proteus is even better than legion - it can at least deal damage higher than a frigate.
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Deva Blackfire
Priory Of The Lemon
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.02 16:16:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Vrabac
Nonsense. Double plated ham legion is generally quite equal to plated neutron gank proteus. Proteus will have more paper dps and more agility, their speed will be about equal, legion will be largely cap independant with an extra medium slot. Legion will be able to pick it's damage type and it will be able to do it's 600 dps, 700 overloaded, at longer range than proteus who will often end up in falloff. Legion will also mostly out-ehp a proteus. Proteus has a nice bonus of a 20km overloaded scram, while legion will probably end up with a free eccm, so take a pick.
Post legion setup please. Thank you.
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Deva Blackfire
Priory Of The Lemon
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.02 22:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Vrabac
Ummm... ok. 450 dps on blasters is pitiful, thorax does notably better. Last I checked hams hit fine at 10 km, what about the cloaky proteus and his 450 dps at arm's reach? 450 dps of kinetic and thermal too.
Thing is: this is COVOPS proteus. Try covops legion and tell me how much it does...
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Proper gank proteus indeed does 900 dps which is truly impressive plus it gets the falloff bonus which is increasing the efficiency further. However it has 3 mids and it shoots cap. It's not exactly perfect combination right?
Thats why you use mwd+scram+small injector. Enough to keep you going even when neuted. Plus you have spare drone bay for ECM drones if something goes wrong and you need to bail.
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As for EHP I'm pretty sure 300k is more than 200k. You can tank the proteus further of course but then you stop doing the impressive dps, which is it's main advantage. 2 eanms provide good tank on amarr t2 base resists.
Both ships get similiar tank but proteus gets 1 more lowslot. This one more low = explo hardener to end up with exactly same lowslot lay as legion (+ explo hard). Same amount of damage mods.
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Drone bay is both good and bad, depending on situation. In low sec proteus will often find itself not using drones at all on sentries, also drones are a delayed form of dps. They are of course better when dealing with smaller ships and can travel further than your guns can hit. I'm using my legion in low sec and I find not having to bother with drones for doing full damage good, as strange as it might seem to you.
Having additional drone bay is always good thing. ECM drones :)
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It's 2 times faster than raven and has 4 times more tank than drake with cruiser signature. Locking speeds and sensor strengths aside. Not to mention how do both drake and raven handle when using 4 slots for speed/tackle/random ewar.
It has barely 2,3x the EHp of drake (typical HAM drake goes just under 90k ehp) but you run with less DPS (HAM drake does 644 maxskill with 5x hobs before overheat). And drakes actually "handle" quite well without wasting midslot for ewar. MWD, web, scram, 2x invul, LSE. If you want ewar just use ECM drones (100 dps less tho). And all that stuff in shiny package worth maybe 45mil isk (before insurance).
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Both looking at eft numbers and actually using and seeing them used in actual game I can't help myself but feel proteus and legion are ballanced at least in the non cloaking fits that are actually meant to fight, not gank npcers, which you can do easily with a rupture.
Just put your setup into eft - 177k ehp with 2x 1600mm vs 165k ehp with 1x 1600mm on proteus... It isnt too good tbh. DPS wise 546 vs 802 (no overheat). With null proteus will deal around 530dps at 12km, legion 546. If prot gets closer damage rises rapidly. Outside of 12km it doesnt matter - your engagement range is only 11,8 (overheated scram) wheras prot can overheat up to around 20km. Plus 20km tackle = more targets caught (especially with scram). I think prot still wins this comparison.
And tbh: 1 mid to 1 low on legion (or fix on assault subsystem) and it would be good match.
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Deva Blackfire
Priory Of The Lemon
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.03 12:13:00 -
[5]
Thats why noone pimp drakes. They are very good, cheap all round BCs. As for rages - yup. I use them almost non-stop tho for hitting cruisers and smaller i change to CN ammo. For BC/BS/caps - rages all the way.
Still this discussion went its places as OP said he doesnt have good HAM skills. In that case prot will always be better than lolgion. And as its quite comparable to HAM drake... its just superior and worth training instead of legion.
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Deva Blackfire
Priory Of The Lemon
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.05 14:14:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Jovialmadness
Ham legions are cookies. They fail. Grow a pair and properly fit them.
My fit is:
225k ehps
400 LAZOR dps
1100m/s velocity
heavy overheat capability(hint)
local rep capability
570 scan res
This is a battle legion not some pu**y ship with a golden retriever sitting in the back trying to pick up blondes.
Lol
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